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rdonj
Stretch
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    Turn 25

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    Stretch


    Number of posts : 136
    Location : Ulm (sub for Joelz)
    Registration date : 2009-03-23

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    Post  Stretch Sat May 09, 2009 1:22 am

    Kara the Eagle King killed 160 people before he tried to attack my crystal sorceress lab. Now he's just another tombstone on the hall of fame list. Vandrott + 4 or 5 hirdmen + the sorceress attacked and killed him nicely, along with PD. It was just him and a yazad.

    174 has yazads and eagle kings in it. It says "spire horn archers, yazads, and eagle kings." It looks like he's positioning that force, as well as some mammoths in 147, to attack the forces I have coming towards his fortress at 165.

    I'm going to blast it with 5-7 seeking arrows this turn. Is that overkill? Unfortunately, don't have people at the Tree yet (for the 50% reduction) so it's 4 gems a pop. Province 174 has 60 people. I have no scout there but a stealth army next door, 26 Hirdmen (elite glamour infantry) and Vanheres (sacred infantry with axe + sword, not that I have a real bless) led by a Vanherse (1A1H), plus about 20 troops and a vandrott in another province next door. I can take a bunch of spire horn archers with that, unless the eagle kings don't die (and even if there are a few I might get lucky).

    Can anyone mind hunt yet? 174 is a good target if you can, as I don't think Caelum has much astral. IF you're going to do it let me know... I have a crystal sorceress doing the 1S 'arcane viewing' or whatever spell so i can maybe see if the eagle kings die.

    I'm pushing Caelum pretty hard at this fort so if you're fighting him elsewhere you might get some breathing room, or room to attack. If we can keep me focused on caelum that'd be great... resist lightning and high defense are two hallmarks of Vanheim after all.

    If there's anyway someone can monitor what happens in 174 this turn besides the 1S viewing spell let me know.
    rdonj
    rdonj
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    Post  rdonj Sat May 09, 2009 3:22 am

    Stretch wrote:Kara the Eagle King killed 160 people before he tried to attack my crystal sorceress lab. Now he's just another tombstone on the hall of fame list...

    Hmm... if you've got enemy commanders running around with large amounts of kills like that, it might be a good idea to use vengeance of the dead on them. Harder to use on someone that has enough reinvigoration to counter their encumbrance, but on something like an eagle king, it should be pretty easy to fatigue them out by them spamming thunderstrikes at the undead. VotD is a thaum 4 spell, requires 3s and 1d. That wouldn't be too hard for one of septimius' augur elders. Just add a few penetration boosters to help it get through.
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    Illuminated One


    Number of posts : 98
    Location : Mictlan
    Registration date : 2009-03-22

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    Post  Illuminated One Sat May 09, 2009 10:41 am

    You automatically see if you killed anyone with mindhunt. Seriously I wouldn't waste to much on the scrying spells, just make a stone sphere and put it on a mage.


    I think casting seeking Arrows on the Eagle Kings is a good idea. 3 Seeking Arrows should kill one however they'll split up among those that are in the province so the best targets would be the lone eagle king raider squads. I can send a lesser horror now, to target another.


    Lanka is under siege from Niefel. I think I will attack him immediately and if enough survive try to to raid him a bit. Just hope that there's no friendly fire between us.


    I'm sorry but it seems that I have to stop locking down Hinnom. I don't think 1 RoT is enough for his patrolling force, more like 2 or 3, and I'll have to build some better forces than Jaguars.
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    Stretch


    Number of posts : 136
    Location : Ulm (sub for Joelz)
    Registration date : 2009-03-23

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    Post  Stretch Sat May 09, 2009 11:50 am

    The eagle king was a surprise attack on one of my eastern provinces that didn't work out for him... I haven't seen any single kings walking around yet. If I do I'll post it here, and I'm keeping a lookout at their forts for who's seen "flying above the army" or commanding it.

    If no one can mind hunt that square then I'll scry it... if someone can then I think if I scry that province that the mind hunt will get me.

    It's a good idea to build a fort/lab on the Tree province, right? To help survive the attacks/horrors that the vets can eventually send?
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    P3D


    Number of posts : 62
    Registration date : 2009-04-01

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    Post  P3D Sat May 09, 2009 1:21 pm

    Horrors?
    Possible but unlikely with Hinnom capital out.

    The Caelian army should be the one took some provs of mine, ~70 archer + 4 EK +Yazata.
    Horrors would be waste with all the lighting. So seeking arrow and fires from afar/sky.

    Stretch,

    IMO get some Black Heart-ed Shock Immune Vans to kill the EKs. They are not kitted out at all. Give them gems to summon air elementals.
    Darloth
    Darloth


    Number of posts : 105
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    Location : C'tis
    Registration date : 2009-02-01

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    Post  Darloth Sat May 09, 2009 3:31 pm

    Who do we have near the water? If we can pressure Atlantis a bit... Their research and gems are just too high - this does mean that if we DO take a water province, it'll probably have nice, pre-located sites.
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    Illuminated One


    Number of posts : 98
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    Post  Illuminated One Sat May 09, 2009 7:07 pm

    Well, if the horrors drop on a pair of Yazad+Eagle King they will likely attack them before the buffing is finished.
    The mage will then loose turns by casting buffs/going into meelee.
    It's not a 100% kill but it's better than letting him fly around freely, imo.

    Otoh I could use the horror to take a province with my scout or cut off retreat routes.

    Also I wouldn't bother about black heart assassins. For the small groups just cloud trapeze in on them or move the vans openly to provinces you are expecting to be attacked - you will always arrive before him, ready to defend the province.
    For the large groups I have my assassins ready next turn.
    I could start to move one against Cealum directly but I'm thinking about killing the Niefel Jarls on Lanka's cap instead of attacking - will have to test how that works out with someone inside the castle, though.
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    Stretch


    Number of posts : 136
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    Post  Stretch Sat May 09, 2009 10:21 pm

    Can anyone else cast some seeking arrows or some other ritual attack at 174 this turn? I am going to attack it with my 2 raiding squads + 7 seeking arrows, and seeking arrow damage is carried over into the actual battle if it doesn't kill the eagle kings (as long as I fight them that turn). I assume that's the same for damage to the army as well. Don't worry, my armies aren't on the square yet.

    They might very well move the kings before I can get to them but I can hope...
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    P3D


    Number of posts : 62
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    Post  P3D Sun May 10, 2009 12:46 am

    Who could use 800 gold the best?

    Have 60 Nature gems if someone is advanced in Alteration to cast the Oak.
    Septimius Severus
    Septimius Severus
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    Post  Septimius Severus Sun May 10, 2009 1:28 am

    We have found a way to get into Fomoria's turn. rdonj, is working on it and if they are salvageable and/or when they are in a better position an alternate can take over. In the meantime any gold and gems will be distributed.
    rdonj
    rdonj
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    Post  rdonj Sun May 10, 2009 2:22 am

    Taking a look at the turn now. I'm not really sure how viable the position is as I have no idea what kind of opposition fomoria is facing right now. Vanheim and ermor seem to have pretty much swallowed fomoria whole. Also, I am rather disappointed that instead of the healthy-looking treasury I was expecting fomoria is bleeding gold and has barely 30(!) in the treasury. So if it is going to be kept alive, it will need to regain territory quickly. They do have 8 fomorian kings (out of 15 total commanders) and a decent hero mage, plus a small number of sacreds still remaining. Hardly enough to fight off any real attack, but maybe enough to fight a small battle or two. He seems to be using a water/nature bless, no idea how strong since the pretender is not active and the prophet is dead.

    They do have a decent number of some gems available. 75a, 41w, and 67d are the most relevant, but they have a few earth, nature and blood as well. What would be really difficult at this point is catching up on research, right now they can only make 119/turn, using every single king to research with, and those currently are needed to lead their (tiny) armies. Magic is sitting at enchant 5, cons 4, evo 4, alt 3. Taking a glance at the score graphs it seems fomoria actually has decent magic atm, a bit surprising to me honestly.

    I could take a turn retaking land near fomoria's capital, but having no history like this, it's going to be really easy to blunder into all sorts of nastiness. Anyway tell me what wants to be done. If I am giving out resources, I'm thinking maybe death gems to c'tis, blood slaves to mictlan, air to vanheim (fomoria could probably do the seeking arrow spam better though if they weren't horribly crippled atm), water to... uh... someone inclined to forge water items, t'ien ch'i maybe. Speak up if you want those.



    So to sum it up, fomoria is pretty badly crippled right now, and with no combat history it's difficult to know what to be prepared for. They might be able to survive, but it likely would not be worth it to bring them back from the brink of death by retaking lands. Otoh their current level of magic is not too shabby, and they should be able to do some damage if they recovered. Where's the nearest enemy anyway, other than atlantis? Fomoria can only attack van/ermor/atlantis right now, has no forged items save for an axe of hate, and can only get underwater with the kings. If you just want to have them survive until turn 30 for bragging rights that should be quite possible... but I wouldn't expect much from fomoria for a long time. Unfortunately there is no way to change fomoria's password so far as I can tell, so unless you hear from the original player an alternate will be unable to take them on.



    Stretch: If you like, fomoria could throw a decent number of seeking arrows at that province. If you want them to, please respond with how many would be ideal.
    rdonj
    rdonj
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    Post  rdonj Sun May 10, 2009 2:39 am

    Septimius - about half of fomoria's current army is in province 237. Not sure if you can kill it or not (10 unmarked), but I would go into the battle expecting heavy losses.


    Also, hinnom's research is climbing rather rapidly... this is very, very bad. I don't know that anything can be done to stop this, but they look like they'll be catching up to atlantis within ~a year. There is a very strong chance of hinnom putting up earth blood deep well or the forge soon, or of grigori descending and spreading chaos in their wake.



    Also: Anyone need air boosters? Fomoria can forge both of 'em.
    Septimius Severus
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    Post  Septimius Severus Sun May 10, 2009 3:10 am

    rdonj wrote:Septimius - about half of fomoria's current army is in province 237. Not sure if you can kill it or not (10 unmarked), but I would go into the battle expecting heavy losses.
    Well at least we know what's what.
    My advice at least for now:
    Move any of Formoria's troops out of 237 if you can do so while under siege.
    Hold onto the two provinces that remain, attack Atlantis if you can, priority on taking/holding 262 (the land connection with Hinnom and the vet mainland).
    Distribute any surplus gems, forge any items and distribute if you can.

    Can you forge the pills of water breathing to get some of your other troops underwater yet? Thought Fomoria was supposed to have other units amphibious capable units.

    I think we can solve the password issue by doing something with the admin PW (PM me for details), so it is possible for an alternate to come in at some point if things look better in the future for all of us (Vanheim and I can exchange provinces with Fomoria to give them land later on).
    Septimius Severus
    Septimius Severus
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    Post  Septimius Severus Sun May 10, 2009 3:16 am

    Darloth wrote:Who do we have near the water? If we can pressure Atlantis a bit... Their research and gems are just too high - this does mean that if we DO take a water province, it'll probably have nice, pre-located sites.
    Fomoria and myself are near Atlantis. I can grab a water province or two, the problem is holding the darn things until I can get a fort up/and or decent units under water. I took Aluvia a few turns ago, and tryed and failed to take it this turn. Will keep trying, also prov. 11 has Ithycids, it will be a few turns though before I have enough.
    Septimius Severus
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    Post  Septimius Severus Sun May 10, 2009 3:21 am

    Ok, tried and failed to re-take water prov 7 Aluvia from Atlantis. Cost me an augur elder and ring of water breathing(though he had affliction and I wanted to get rid of him anyway).

    I repelled Nielfel\'s counter attack on province 11 killing the two Jarls. I will wait a turn before moving on 14 again. Unfortunately my prophet died as a result of an unlucky holy avenger strike. Damn!

    In a turn or two I\'ll also try again to grab some water provinces from Atlantis.

    Question: Does casting bless multiple times do anything special that divine bless doesn\'t already do? I noticed the vets doing it.


    Last edited by Septimius Severus on Sun May 10, 2009 3:24 am; edited 1 time in total
    rdonj
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    Post  rdonj Sun May 10, 2009 3:23 am

    Can't do that unfortunately, they are rather lacking in stealth ability. If you want the province it might be best to leave and let me shuffle the troops out to the neighboring province, and have them work their way to the cap.

    Vanheim owns province 262 right now, so for the moment that is safe. Fomoria could maybe get into the water though. I could forge pills of waterbreathing, so yeah, it should be quite possible to get fomoria underwater. Whether they can stay there or not I have no idea.
    rdonj
    rdonj
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    Post  rdonj Sun May 10, 2009 3:28 am

    Septimius Severus wrote:Question: Does casting bless multiple times do anything special that divine bless doesn\'t already do? I noticed the vets doing it.

    Nope. The only reason to cast bless multiple times is to make sure all your sacreds get blessed. Sometimes they may cast it multiple times for even a single commander just to ensure that the bless sticks, because it can miss sometimes.
    Septimius Severus
    Septimius Severus
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    Post  Septimius Severus Sun May 10, 2009 3:30 am

    rdonj wrote:
    Can't do that unfortunately, they are rather lacking in stealth ability. If you want the province it might be best to leave and let me shuffle the troops out to the neighboring province, and have them work their way to the cap.

    Vanheim owns province 262 right now, so for the moment that is safe. Fomoria could maybe get into the water though. I could forge pills of waterbreathing, so yeah, it should be quite possible to get fomoria underwater. Whether they can stay there or not I have no idea.
    Ok, I'll back my troops out, evacuate 237.
    rdonj
    rdonj
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    Post  rdonj Sun May 10, 2009 3:32 am

    Will do, that will have to wait until your troops are gone though. You should be able to attack next turn, but you can wait an extra turn if you want to play it safe.
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    Stretch


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    Post  Stretch Sun May 10, 2009 4:12 am

    Stretch: If you like, fomoria could throw a decent number of seeking arrows at that province. If you want them to, please respond with how many would be ideal.

    I'm casting 7 at 174 and it takes 3 to definitely kill an eagle king. I think that there are 4 eagle kings in that province although I'm not positive. Please cast 5 and lets see how we do.

    Also, I can use the air gems for seeking arrows a bit better as I have the -50% enchantment costs province. I just backed off massive cloud trapezing in there because I saw a chance to hurt Caelum.

    We could also use Fomoria's troops to bulldoze a path through 262 and into Niefel's lands.
    rdonj
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    Post  rdonj Sun May 10, 2009 4:34 am

    I meant if fomoria had the enchant site instead. I'm not sure offhand how many vans can cast seeking arrows without boosters, they do have pretty decent air though so maybe you can do it better anyway. In any case I will prepare that deluge of arrows for you and send what gems I can.

    I'm not sure how well fomoria could bulldoze into niefel there, but I can give it a shot if you like. Once all fomoria's troops are gathered there will be ~26 unmarked to throw into battle. Might do something.


    Fomoria could almost use some of that gold being offered right now (bit of a gold deficit), but since we aren't sure yet that they're sticking around perhaps it would just be better to live with it. Sacreds rarely abandon anyway, and that's most of what's left....
    Septimius Severus
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    Post  Septimius Severus Sun May 10, 2009 10:13 am

    rdonj wrote:I'm not sure how well fomoria could bulldoze into niefel there, but I can give it a shot if you like. Once all fomoria's troops are gathered there will be ~26 unmarked to throw into battle. Might do something.
    We are going to have to decide who is going to bulldoze into Hinnom via 262. It will be either Van, Fomoria, or me.

    1. If it is worth it to keep Fomoria around, and let them concentrate on that land route(and maybe a bit of Atlantis), stretch you'll probably need to give up a few provinces and I'll need to stay out of 237 permanently.

    2. Van can take take it to Hinnom via 262.

    3. I can do it.

    In cases 2 or 3, if rdonj feels it would be useful to keep Fomoria's cap alive just to act as a magic research, item forging distro site, that may be a good idea.

    I suppose we should throw those troops at Hinnom first. Then we need to decide which option to go with. Let me know. I've got all these barbarians howling for a fight.
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    Illuminated One


    Number of posts : 98
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    Post  Illuminated One Sun May 10, 2009 12:23 pm

    I could need some gold quite badly, I don't have much income anymore and this turn my temple burned down. 400 should be enough though.


    edit: I'm not going to attack Niefel in Lanka, he's trying to break the siege himself. I will nontheless keep my forces ready to attack next turn and hold the line against Atlantis until I can reinforce/Niefel is pushed back.
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    Post  rdonj Sun May 10, 2009 3:27 pm

    Okay, I'm going to go ahead with giving c'tis the death gems. Still not sure what to do with the water gems, if someone wants them speak up. I'm not going to be moving anything this turn it seems.


    I don't know if fomoria will be salvageable, but with all those unmarked and a decent number of kings, fomoria should be able to put up a bit of a fight against niefel. In any case it would be better for the team than killing off fomoria's units yourselves would be. Or fomoria could just go drown itself in the ocean, that would take quite a decent number of gems though to accomplish very quickly. I think the best course of action at this point is to set fomoria loose on niefelheim and see how many niefels can be brought down before the fomorian army is wiped out. And if it seems like it's going well then you can see about fomoria returning as a full player. But go ahead and bring in one of the alternates. I'll submit this turn and the alternate can start working on the path to niefelheim.

    I don't think there's much point in keeping fomoria alive for research... I guess they could cast phantasmal attacks eventually, or maybe try to get ahold of some air queens to deny them from caelum. That would probably be more useful, but I expect caelum is closer to air queens than fomoria is (0 conj research). They can forge some useful equipment, but between vanheim and c'tis you should be able to cover it all anyway. So their worth as forge slaves is somewhat questionable as well.
    Darloth
    Darloth


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    Post  Darloth Sun May 10, 2009 4:01 pm

    Death gems are always handy - I can drop them into skull mentors if nothing else, my research is quite behind I feel. In general I suggest giving the gems away just incase something terrible happens and the cap is lost - if the player is eliminated the gems will just cease to be, yes? I could use some of the water gems, give me 10-20 if no one else wants them, I can get to water bracelets and W2 that way fairly soon.

    Does anyone have a stone sphere they could send me? I don't have natural scouts, only have a few indies and a couple of black servants kicking about (usually doing things other than -just- scouting), so being able to scry would be useful for me.

    I plan to try and attack Niefel and/or Hel in the next few turns, mostly with undead supported by lizards - Hel has Dust to Dust, so I'm not entirely sure how to procede there - lizard warriors might work but I can't sustain the gold cost for too many. Combined arms is probably the way to go.

    Septimus, fair warning, I have hazardous materials passing through Niefel's beachhead this turn, on their way to Utonshire and from there his farmlands.

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